Anyone who has ever debated a creationist has heard the same arguments over and over again. This time, they were presented by a certain Yomin Postelnik at the Canada Free Press in a most ridiculous article called “Logical Proof of the Existence of a Divine Creator, Why Atheism in Not Logically Sound” a lengthy piece, which uses many many words to convey precisely nothing! Mr. Postelnik opens his article with the following:
One of the beautiful aspects of self evident truths is that they can be proven on both the simplest and the most complex of levels. By contrast, to make an argument for what is in fact an illogical fallacy, one must use plenty of skill, sophistry and remain beholden to a dogmatic protection of what is really an illogical position.
Now how seriously are we supposed to take someone who starts off with such loads of crap? First of all, a self evident truth does not need to be proven at any level, let alone “complex” ones, and if such need arises then said truth is not self evident, so what in the hell is this guy really saying? His “logic” is failing him within his first sentence. Second, what in the hell is an “illogical” fallacy? I have heard of logical fallacies, but illogical ones are news to me! A “Logical Fallacy” means a failing of logic, so by extension an illogical fallacy must mean a failing of illogic, which would make it logical, right? Thirdly, you don’t make an argument for a fallacy, that statement makes no sense, because a fallacy is itself an argument, albeit an invalid one. One cannot make an argument about an argument, but this is what this guy seems to think. Fourthly, one can commit a fallacy without being dogmatic. A fallacy is simply bad logic and it does not necessarily imply dogma. To make such assertion is quite infantile and betrays a complete lack of understanding of the basics of logic. But let’s not delve too long on the first paragraph, there is so much more to sink our teeth in the rest of this piece of workd.
Proof of a conscious Creator is readily available. The simplest proof (yet one that no atheist has ever been able to counter effectively) is that a universe of this size and magnitude does not somehow build itself, just as a set of encyclopedias doesn’t write itself or form randomly from the spill of a massive inkblot.
There we go again. Since this moron seems so fond of fallacies he may like to know that he just committed one himself, one that is very typical of cretinists creationists. It is the argument from ignorance, the “I’m too stupid to understand” one. It always amazes me how the inevitable rebuttal seems to escape these childish amateurs. If you are willing to stick to the logic of the above argument then you must explain the origins of your Creator, because by God he couldn’t have come into existence on his own. A Creator does not somehow build himself. And he claims no atheist has never been able to effectively counter his “argument”. I think I just did, twice. One, you’re too stupid to understand the real explanation and you reject it and replace it with an infantile explanation, your own version of Santa Claus. Secondly, your answer is only making matters worse as you are assuming the existence of a greatly greatly complex being to explain the existence of the universe, in effect replacing one mystery with an even bigger mystery. So what kind of bullshit answer is that?
No one in their right mind would claim that 10,000 hundred story buildings built themselves from randomness, even over time. Yet those who doubt the existence of a Creator believe that an entire universe, containing all of the billions of elements necessary for life to form, may have come about without a builder. As such, they give credence to billions of times more coincidences to having come about.
As a matter of fact no one has claimed that yet, that I am aware off, about the 10,000 hundred story buildings. What we have claimed though is that some even greater things were in fact not created by any intelligent being, such as, ohh I don’t know.. freaking mount Everest? You see, geology and plate tectonics can quite perfectly explain its creation, and no 100 story building in the world even comes close to Everest. So what does his argument prove? Absolutely nothing, because it is in fact another LOGICAL fallacy, a non sequitur ( I hope I spelled that correctly, my Latin is non existent!). The fact that some things are designed or created for a purpose does not imply that everything is created or designed for a purpose. And you cannot say that just because something less complex was designed then everything more complex must have been designed. Shoe laces were clearly designed, but they are so elementary that everything else, by the above logic, must have been designed including clouds and rain which are quite more complicated than shoe laces. Does this guy think there are little elves smoking in the mountains and making clouds? Who the hell knows!
They believe that not only did whole planets appear spontaneously, but also believe that the fact that these planets do not collide as meteors do, that they have gravity, that they contain the proper atmospheric conditions for life to take hold and contain sustenance to sustain this life all happened by mere fluke. Yet the same people would (rightly) denounce as preposterous the notion that the Egyptian pyramids built themselves. They would point to the structure and detailed design of these impressive inanimate objects. Yet they outrageously chalk up to coincidence billions upon billions of times more detail and design in all parts of life found in this universe.
Planets appeared spontaneously? Now, I hate to use definitions but Answers.com defines spontaneously as “Of one’s own free will: freely, voluntarily, willfully, willingly. Idioms: of one’s own accord, on one’s own volition.” I don’t know who this moron is consulting for his astronomical facts, but no one has ever made the claim that planets have a free will, or have ever done anything willfully. This idiot keeps exposing the limits of his intelligence. To my knowledge, no astronomer ever has claimed that any planet in the universe is a “fluke”. This is an outright lie, a made up enemy. It is in fact yet another logical fallacy, the one known as the “Straw Man”, make up your own enemy, put whatever words you want in his mouth so that you may attack him easily. Furthermore, who ever claimed that all these other planets “that they contain the proper atmospheric conditions for life to take hold and contain sustenance to sustain this life”? As far as I know only one planet has the proper atmospheric conditions for life and we happen to be having this debate on it’s surface. If this genius is aware of other planets with an atmosphere similar to Earth’s he should let the rest of the world know about it and who knows maybe win a Nobel for his troubles.
While there are complex proofs of the Divine, some dating back to the philosophical writings of Plato and others using modern science, the most clearly logical concepts are all readily apparent and simple. An entire world does not create itself.
Where are these proofs he alludes to? Is he talking about Michael Behe’s irreducible complexity? Ah, yes he falls back upon the “I’m too stupid” line of reasoning. An entire world does not create itself. Of course not, no one ever claimed that. Does an entire Creator create himself?
I am getting a headache by this guy’s unending assault to reason and logic, and this entry is getting too long anyway. Stay tuned for Part 2 and (hopefully not) Part 3 in the days to come. In the mean time you can head over to the website and read his whole article. But I must warn you, without a break in between paragraphs for sarcastic and logical remarks, you run major risks. You were warned, proceed at your own risk!
Read this and bleed! Yes, the geniuses at the (Un)Discovery Institute have discovered that cars were designed by engineers and somehow they think this supports their retarded hypothesis for ID!
Disclaimer – Foul language will be used profusely throughout this post. If you are easily offended by language I suggest you stop reading now! I’m not fucking kidding!
So, where do I start. How about some quotes from the moronic article.
I recently came across this Hyandai car advertisement, stating: “the i30 name has been chosen to reflect the car’s European styling and its all-round intelligent design.” I decided to see if there were other similar examples, and searches uncovered many examples.
The website “CarReview.com” reviewed the Honda Civic SI and praises its “very modern looking interior, with flowing lines and an intelligent design.” Indeed, Honda’s own website has a page with specs on the Honda S2000 roadster which states, “Further intelligent design details, such as lightweight valve springs and the use of low-friction plating, prove the Honda S2000 is a model of engineering perfection.”
A news article covering Nissan’s new “advanced vehicle-to-traffic-light communication technology” is titled, “Intelligent Design, Transportation-Style, From Nissan.” An article about the Toyota Camry states that, “[t]he 2006 Camry redefines global standards for comfort, safety and intelligent design.” Elsewhere Toyota announces an environment-friendly concept car which gets great fuel economy, in part, because “weight reduction is achieved by intelligent design of interior components, such as the instrument panel and heater modules.” Similarly, an article on Toyota.com about Camry Hybrids calls the car “a world-class sedan that not only redefines global standards for comfort, performance and intelligent design, but also is available, for the first time, with Toyota’s Hybrid Synergy Drive.”
A news release advertising a line of RV’s announces: “Intelligent Design Features Incorporated Into Fleetwood’s 2006 Bounder Diesel and Expedition RV’s.” Even Lexus gets into the action, reporting on its Lexus.com website that the inspiration behind the Lexus SC430, “was to create an elegant, sophisticated and intelligent design.” Indeed, a Wall Street Journal blog writes about Chrysler’s efforts to improve their products, titling the article, “The Case for Intelligent Design at Chrysler.”
Finally, if you want a nice example of an irreducibly complex system, try this YouTube video of a Honda Accord commercial. The commercial ends by saying, “Isn’t it nice when things just work?” You won’t find anyone suggesting that the machines in this commercial “work” due to anything other than intelligent design:
Why does this matter? Because:
These advertisements and reviews don’t say “random-variation-and-unguided-selection-based design.” They say “intelligent design.” And when advertisers mention the “evolution” of a product, you can almost surely bet that it’s intelligently guided “evolution,” not the Darwinian processes of random mutation and unguided natural selection.
Oh, but the author doesn’t want us to read too much into this article.
And before you start to nitpick reasons why don’t like this post, don’t forget my words at the beginning: “Don’t read into this post too much, but take it as a series of curious observations.”
That’s fair enough. I won’t read too much into this post, just what it implies. I think even the IDiot author must accept that there is something to read into this post otherwise he wouldn’t have posted the damn thing, right?
So let’s start at the beginning shall we. THIS IS THE STUPIDEST PRO ID ARGUMENT I HAVE HEARD SO FAR, BAR NONE! It is the “Ultimate Boeing 747” argument on freaking stupidity inducing drugs! Why you ask? Well let me elaborate on that?
First, they make this wild statement: “We’re often told that Darwinism is like a scientific magic bullet that can solve anything.” Who’s fucking telling them and how often are they being told? Because science says no such thing, about ANY of it’s theories. Nothing in this world solves everything and no scientist ever made that claim. Unless they were crazy as shit that is, and there are a few of those around (some employed at the Discovery Institute no doubt). I think I know what’s happening here. These guys are so ignorant about the basics of Evolution (such as it’s name which is not Darwinism, morons!) that THEY THINK we claim it can solve anything. So they’re just a bunch of stupid, confused fucks who are in fact attacking their own ignorance and stupidity, which is a fruitless endeavor because they’re not getting any smarter any time soon, so they’ll never win that fight.
Then they say that “We’re also told that intelligent design threatens to destroy science.”. Shit they got one thing right! Good job IDiots, keep it up!
Then, they make the observation that cars are INTELLIGENTLY DESIGNED by engineers. Good so far, cars are in fact designed by engineers and they tend to be pretty intelligent people (although I don’t know where Kia is getting it’s engineers, but that’s another issue completely!). And they then feel the need to point out that cars did not evolve due to “random-variation-and-unguided-selection-based design.” but are intelligently designed. And this is where the dipshits drown in their own piss!
Now what the fuck does the fact that cars were designed have to day about Evolution? Yes cars were designed, so were computers, ice cream cones and countless other things that Science has created. But what kind of implication does that have for living things? None whatsoever! Because IDiots, cars are inanimate objects. They do not reproduce. They have no DNA. Evolution works on living things, which have DNA. So how the fuck are you gonna make an argument about a living thing by looking at a nonliving thing?
Of course cars don’t evolve in the biological sense. Even pigeon breeding is not evolution dipshits, even if it has to do with living things. Evolution is not a directed process, car building is. But even if you run with their example, it still does not work in their favor. Because cars do go through mutations, what do they think the engineers spit out perfect little models on their first try? Think again assholes! And oh yes there is strong selective pressures in the market. Why do they think they’re not driving a Yugo? The only difference is that Evolution is not guided while this process is. And that is their whole point anyway, it is a guided process, thus intelligently designed.
Claiming that because cars are intelligently designed by engineers means that we were designed by a supreme Intelligent Designer is logically equivalent to claiming that because cars run on gasoline we should be gulping down gallons of gasoline everyday to keep ourselves running! Are they willing to do that first?
We often hear the word supernatural being thrown around. There’s even a television show, a pretty bad television show, by that same title. But what does supernatural mean? In laymen terms it means outside of nature, something which cannot be explained, cannot be touched by our senses, cannot be felt, smelled. In other words is not comprehensible, something we cannot and should not try to understand or explain.
It is a lame excuse for our ignorance.
See, the word itself does not have any meaning. If something exists, especially if this something can interact with our natural world, it must itself be natural, for we have defined natural as everything that exists. Trees and mountains are natural, the stars and the galaxies are natural, dark matter and dark energy is natural. Everything we know exists is natural. There is nothing supernatural about anything which really is there.
There are natural things which we cannot explain. Our knowledge and science is limited at this point in our existence. So there are things we have yet to discover and the more we discover, through the scientific method, the less will be left to the supernatural. Just like God, the supernatural also has been shrinking and shrinking with every advance of Science. And it will continue to do so as Science advances, but it probably will never die out completely as the nature we live in is full of mysteries, full of things for us to discover. Until we do, they will be branded as supernatural.
Defaulting to a supernatural explanation is anti scientific. Appealing to an unexplained phenomenon as a solution to another unexplained phenomenon is a useless exercise and a science stopper. In this prism, Intelligent Design is a science stopper to the contrary of its proponents claims. Inferring the existence of an Intelligent Designer, without plotting out what this Intelligent Designer should look like or behave like, is childish and scientifically dishonest. ID is the ultimate argument from Ignorance. Defaulting to an explanation which cannot be tested by science, simply because they’re not smart enough to come up with a natural solution, is pseudo-science, I don’t care how many PhDs you may have! A PhD means nothing if you cannot tell the difference between a scientific argument and a philosophical one.
Why are people so scared to admit that they don’t know? Why must they have an answer, even if it is wrong? Why is having a wrong answer better than having no answer? I don’t know, but for a lot of people this seems to be the case. When you’re arguing religion with a believer you will inevitably hear the argument that religion brings comfort to millions of people, as if that has anything to do with it veracity. A lie that makes people feel good is still a lie, and whoever propagates such lies is a liar, and that behavior cannot be justified by the results. The end does not always justify the means.
The supernatural explanation is lame. It is anti scientific. It epitomizes surrender, giving up. It’s message is clear: “Stop doing your science. Stop trying to explain things. The explanation is beyond you, beyond anyone. Stop! Stop! Stop!”. What good can come of that? Would we be here today, as a society, if people had obeyed this order in the past? The never ending quest for excellence, for improvement, for knowledge are the building blocks of Science. Dogma is the building block of the Supernatural. The choice is a no brainer really. Unfortunately lots of people seem to be willing to make the wrong choice.
The text of the ad follows below:
But did you know that 86% of Americans say they believe in God? Since we all know that 86 out of every 100 of us are Christians, who believe in God, we at Keiffe & Sons Ford wonder why we don’t tell the other 14% to sit down and shut up. I guess maybe I just offended 14% of the people who are listening to this message. Well, if that is the case then I say that’s tough, this is America folks, it’s called free speech. None of us at Keiffe & Sons Ford are afraid to speak out. Keiffe & Sons Ford on Sierra Highway in Mojave and Rosamond, if we don’t see you today, by the grace of God, we’ll be here tomorrow.
Logical Fallacy #1 – Just because 86% of Americans believe in a God, does not mean that 86% of Americans are christians you stupid idiots.
Logical Fallacy #2 – You just told someone to sit down and shut up because they are in the minority. On the other hand you claim that freedom of speech matters in America. You can’t have it both ways you stupid moron! While freedom of speech does allow you the right to tell people to “shut up” that very fact means that you are against freedom of speech. I would never tell a minority to sit down and shut up just because I am in the majority. I may call them stupid morons if I don’t like what i hear though.
That all right with you, YOU STUPID MORONS? You can take your $2.99 a gallon gas deal and stick it up your ass. How’s that for freedom of speech, retards?
A football fan in England was told by a cop to remove an England flag from his car because it could be deemed racist.
Ben Smith, 18, was pulled over for a routine spot check by an officer who inspected his tyres and road tax.
But the labourer was stunned to be told that a St George flag covering his Vauxhall Corsa’s parcel shelf was offensive to immigrants.
Tory MP Philip Davies, who campaigns against political correctness, said: “If this is the case then it is disgusting and totally outrageous and the policeman ought to be ashamed of himself.
“How on earth can it be racist to fly your own flag in your own country?
This is ridiculous, and it’s not the first ridiculous thing coming out of England lately. Just a few days ago I blogged about the 15 year old who got in trouble for holding up a sing calling Scientology a cult. Where is Bill Maher when you need him?
Since when is it a crime to offend someone? I thought England was a free country. I have said this a million times and it seems appropriate to repeat it yet again:
NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT NOT TO BE OFFENDED! PERIOD!
If you own country’s flag could be deemed offensive, what isn’t? No offense to immigrants but if you’ve moved to a country whose flag you cannot stand, then you need to pack up your bags and find yoursefl another county to hate.
By the way, before people start yelling at me, I am an immigrant myself, so I think I am allowed to say such things about immigrants.